Success due to Battle distributing more?


#1

I’ve noticed a couple people mention that Talor Battle is trusting his teammates more now, and getting the ball to them more, leading to our recent success.

From my perspective, it seems like Talor has been distributing the ball very well for most of the year - the key difference now being that some of the supporting cast is finally stepping up to make shots and complete plays.

Now, there have been some games where he has gone into do-it-all-himself mode, but typically that occurred after he tried to get everyone involved, but other people weren’t scoring, so he had to take over.

Thoughts?


#2

From a stats perspective, and doing some back-of-the-envelope calculations (i.e., I’m not Ken Pomeroy), it looks like Battle has generally distributed the ball better in the past 5 games or so–his percentage of individual possessions with assists have had 4 of their highest 5 values of the B10 season in that stretch (his only values exceeding 44% occurred during this time). This change may be a response to the dismal 10% of possessions with assists (he had only 1 assist) at Purdue. Of course, this does not take into account attempted assists that bounced off the hands of the intended recipients…

Meanwhile, the percentage of his team’s shots that he took during the NW game was by far the lowest of the B10 season (16.7%, about half his season average), but that did perk back up to 28.2% against Michigan–still lower than his seasonal average of about 34%.

Is this a trend? A few more data points will make things clearer, though by that time the season will be over :frowning:


#3

[quote=“BobK, post:2, topic:874”]From a stats perspective, and doing some back-of-the-envelope calculations (i.e., I’m not Ken Pomeroy), it looks like Battle has generally distributed the ball better in the past 5 games or so–his percentage of individual possessions with assists have had 4 of their highest 5 values of the B10 season in that stretch (his only values exceeding 44% occurred during this time). This change may be a response to the dismal 10% of possessions with assists (he had only 1 assist) at Purdue. Of course, this does not take into account attempted assists that bounced off the hands of the intended recipients…

Meanwhile, the percentage of his team’s shots that he took during the NW game was by far the lowest of the B10 season (16.7%, about half his season average), but that did perk back up to 28.2% against Michigan–still lower than his seasonal average of about 34%.

Is this a trend? A few more data points will make things clearer, though by that time the season will be over :([/quote]

Is it the chicken or the egg? Does Battle shoot less because his teammates are hitting shots? Or does his teammates hit shots because he is doing a better job setting them up? Hard to say. But back in the first Iverson run with the Sixers, I always thought they played better when #3 took less shots.


#4

Is Battle really distributing more? Or are his teammates capitalizing more on Battle’s distribution?


#5

That’s one of the big questions. Not sure what is the cause and effect of this situation. Just needs to continue working.


#6

hasn’t battle also been under the weather the last two games too?


#7

Can’t we just look at everyone’s shooting percentages over the past few games when compared to the other games to see if they are capitalizing more?

Lets see if this trend continues… Hopefully it does.


#8

Both schools of thought are right. Battle is distributing more because other guys are actually hitting shots. And other guys are getting more shots and therefore hitting more shots because Battle is getting them the ball more. As a point guard, you make a couple of nice assists to guys to get them open looks and they throw up bricks or can’t catch the ball, and human nature says that you stop doing that and look to take the shot yourself. Conversely, if you distribute and somebody makes a shot, you are more likely to try and continue to distribute.


#9

PSU starters, other than Battle, are hitting 59% (36-61) of their shots the past two games.

In the 12 losses, PSU starters other than Battle hit 45.4% (120-264)


#10

Instead of just looking at shooting %'s for non-Battle players, another thing to consider (and much harder to measure), is how many times do they receive a pass from Battle and not shoot? That could be due to a missed pass, a turnover, or just passing the ball to someone else or back to Battle (which could be from not having confidence to shoot, or just making an extra pass to find a more open player).

Seems like there have been a lot of possessions this year where Battle would pass the ball but nobody would want to take a shot, so he would get the ball back and have to create something as time ran out. I think the confidence of his teammates has grown recently, so we are seeing fewer possessions where they are passing up open shots, leaving Talor with trying to force something.


#11

I think that Battle has always moved the ball well, but these past two games he has looked to move the ball first and then shoot. I watched him pass instead of take an open 3, which isn’t very Talor like. I think these past two games he has gone in thinking that he is a pass first PG. Suppose to a lot of games when he has had to do it himself,or has played that way.The trust he is starting to show could really go a long way.


#12

[quote=“Tom, post:4, topic:874”]Is Battle really distributing more? Or are his teammates capitalizing more on Battle’s distribution?[/quote]That’s part of it, but i think they are simply executing the offense better. Better picks and faster movement. Everyone just seems to be working harder and more together than before. The MSU game was an atrocious offensive effort. Since then they’ve shown purpose.


#13
[quote="Tom, post:4, topic:874"]Is Battle really distributing more? Or are his teammates capitalizing more on Battle's distribution?[/quote]That's part of it, but i think they are simply executing the offense better. Better picks and faster movement. Everyone just seems to be working harder and more together than before. The MSU game was an atrocious offensive effort. Since then they've shown purpose.

I wonder if our offense in the MSU game was so awful b/c Talor was hot in the first half. Maybe guys assume Talor will bail us out w/ a 32ft bomb…therefore they don’t move and set screens like they should…and then Talor cools off and we throw up 32 ft lame ducks. Not the way it should happen but it wouldn’t shock me if there’s some truth to it.


#14

Another something to add to the pile. Battle has played much better at the 2 guard when Frazier has run the point then he did earlier in the year. When the year started, when Frazier was in, Battle played a very awkward game as he was used to having the ball in his hands and creating from there and he was not a catch and shoot off of a screen type of player. The last two games, I have seen a different Battle when Frazier is in the game, he seems to have figured out how to play with Frazier and Frazier has a better feel for Battle.


#15

Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and “The Victors” ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.


#16

[quote=“NittanyIllini, post:15, topic:874”]Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and “The Victors” ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.[/quote]

Please-could we reserve TIMMY for Curley and use TIM for our basketball player.


#17
Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and "The Victors" ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.

Please-could we reserve TIMMY for Curley and use TIM for our basketball player.

Would “Yah-Yah Timmah” suffice?


#18

[quote=“NittanyIllini, post:15, topic:874”]Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and “The Victors” ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.[/quote]

Maybe we match up well against NW and UM. But we’ve played well in other games – including against Wisconsin – that we should have won, but didn’t. And we didn’t lose because we didn’t match up well. We lost because we didn’t know how to win (or something like that). Our record should be no worse than 7-7 right now. We should have beaten Michigan (first game) and at Wisconsin for sure. And I’ll throw in the one Illini game we had in control but let slip away. And I believe that if we won the first UM game, we’d have beaten Indiana and Iowa as well. And maybe we even pull out the second Gopher game instead of losing the way we did. Actually, the more I type the more I think we are good enough to be 8-6 right now (that should draw some heat from a couple of you-know-whos around here). And it is upsetting me thinking about it. But that’s why my confidence is high for next season.


#19
[quote="NittanyIllini, post:15, topic:874"]Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and "The Victors" ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.[/quote]

Please-could we reserve TIMMY for Curley and use TIM for our basketball player.

Would “Yah-Yah Timmah” suffice?


I got a kick out of that one -good one!! Point for you!!!

#20
Part of all this is that we just match up well against both NW and "The Victors" ::).

I want to see how they do against a team like Ohio State, who poses a lot more issues due to their length and the active zone that they play.

With that said, I think Battle is the 2nd best player in the Big Ten behind Turner. He’s been able to adjust his game beautifully over the past two contests and hasn’t forced the issue, especially with his shot selection.

Switch Battle and Lucas or Battle and McCamey and both those teams, MSU and Illinois, would be better. Put Battle on OSU or Purdue…WATCH OUT.

As for Frazier, I really hope that ED gives Timmy all the run he can get with Battle at the 2-guard. Timmy’s maturation has made a huge difference IMO.

Maybe we match up well against NW and UM. But we’ve played well in other games – including against Wisconsin – that we should have won, but didn’t. And we didn’t lose because we didn’t match up well. We lost because we didn’t know how to win (or something like that). Our record should be no worse than 7-7 right now. We should have beaten Michigan (first game) and at Wisconsin for sure. And I’ll throw in the one Illini game we had in control but let slip away. And I believe that if we won the first UM game, we’d have beaten Indiana and Iowa as well. And maybe we even pull out the second Gopher game instead of losing the way we did. Actually, the more I type the more I think we are good enough to be 8-6 right now (that should draw some heat from a couple of you-know-whos around here). And it is upsetting me thinking about it. But that’s why my confidence is high for next season.


I love your confidence and I have actually been confident for the last seven years going into each season. This year I commented to a friend that this team seemed way ahead of other teams in Oct/Nov and then the bottom dropped out. I have taken a good deal of heat about my pre season comments and have decided to stop predicting future success. So would you agree that next year Ed either produces an NCAA appearance for this team or he is adios? I don’t think there could possibly be an excuse left for not going NCAA in year 8!!