Post game Views


#1

What happened? I want to watch the game again before I make too many conclusions. Now I just have questions. What happened to rotation from last game? What happened to Edwards? It seems Ed is “seaching, seaching and seaching” every game.


#2

[quote=“tundra, post:1, topic:754”]What happened? I want to watch the game again before I make too many conclusions. Now I just have questions. What happened to rotation from last game? What happened to Edwards? It seems Ed is “seaching, seaching and seaching” every game.[/quote]Edwards started…Played under control and smart…Was then benched for most of the 2nd half in favor of Jeff who did absolutely nothing right. Can’t figure out Ed’s thinking on this one


#3

For the first time since who knows when, Illinois came to play a complete game.

It’s human nature to look within at your own problems, which there are many, yet not take a look at the other side of the court for your answers.

Plain and simple, Illinois came to play.

They moved the ball well, they shot the ball well. Though they let PSU do a few things on their offensive end, they stepped up their defense when it mattered most.

Sure PSU missed a number of free throws which would have and should have made the game a lot more interesting. But fact is, on the possessions that came to decide the game (prior to the free throw fest), the Illini finally played good, hard, sound defense. Something that has been lacking from them this season.

You have to earn each and every victory in the Big Ten this season. There are no gimme’s. PSU can hang with the best the Big Ten has to offer for the first 35-38 minutes of the game, but when the real talent of the Big Ten has to step up and win a game down a stretch, PSU’s horses just aren’t as good at doing that as others horses.

I hate to harp on the past, for I am usually one who deals in the present and future, but this team misses Cornley and Pringle and in some regards Morrissey. They knew how to finish and win games. This collection of talent that the Nittany’s possess do not have that knowledge yet and I’m not sure if they will obtain it this season.

As for Edwards, who knows…I didn’t think he did anything wrong other than let Bill Cole shoot lights out from 3. Maybe that got him demoted to the bench for the 2nd half in favor of Brooks. Wrong move IMO.


#4

Illini, I hear ya. But I don’t totally agree. I don’t think any basketball team “plays in space.” That is they against each other. To say one team “played well” is thus a half sentence. It should be “Illinois played well against PSU.” The PSU players on the court had A LOT to do with Illinois playing well.
It’s possible the other team may “play well” in all of our 18 league games this season. More than standard probability…indeed!


#5

[quote=“NittanyIllini, post:3, topic:754”]For the first time since who knows when, Illinois came to play a complete game.

It’s human nature to look within at your own problems, which there are many, yet not take a look at the other side of the court for your answers.

Plain and simple, Illinois came to play.

They moved the ball well, they shot the ball well. Though they let PSU do a few things on their offensive end, they stepped up their defense when it mattered most.

Sure PSU missed a number of free throws which would have and should have made the game a lot more interesting. But fact is, on the possessions that came to decide the game (prior to the free throw fest), the Illini finally played good, hard, sound defense. Something that has been lacking from them this season.

You have to earn each and every victory in the Big Ten this season. There are no gimme’s. PSU can hang with the best the Big Ten has to offer for the first 35-38 minutes of the game, but when the real talent of the Big Ten has to step up and win a game down a stretch, PSU’s horses just aren’t as good at doing that as others horses.

I hate to harp on the past, for I am usually one who deals in the present and future, but this team misses Cornley and Pringle and in some regards Morrissey. They knew how to finish and win games. This collection of talent that the Nittany’s possess do not have that knowledge yet and I’m not sure if they will obtain it this season.

As for Edwards, who knows…I didn’t think he did anything wrong other than let Bill Cole shoot lights out from 3. Maybe that got him demoted to the bench for the 2nd half in favor of Brooks. Wrong move IMO.[/quote]As many around us in the BJC pointed out (including myself) they shot well because they had wide open looks. Our defense was once again incognito . I know PSU is offensively challenged but at least they can try and get into someone on defense,but that hasn’t been the case for 7 years and I don’t think it will change anytime soon. Listening to Dick postgame he made it a point how poorly some of the Illini players have shot from the arc and in general prior to this game and how that seems to be the case with a lot of teams and individual players. They shoot below avg a majority of the season and then seem to light it up against us. I wonder why? NO D


#6

[quote=“NittanyIllini, post:3, topic:754”]For the first time since who knows when, Illinois came to play a complete game.

It’s human nature to look within at your own problems, which there are many, yet not take a look at the other side of the court for your answers.

Plain and simple, Illinois came to play.

They moved the ball well, they shot the ball well. Though they let PSU do a few things on their offensive end, they stepped up their defense when it mattered most.

Sure PSU missed a number of free throws which would have and should have made the game a lot more interesting. But fact is, on the possessions that came to decide the game (prior to the free throw fest), the Illini finally played good, hard, sound defense. Something that has been lacking from them this season.

You have to earn each and every victory in the Big Ten this season. There are no gimme’s. PSU can hang with the best the Big Ten has to offer for the first 35-38 minutes of the game, but when the real talent of the Big Ten has to step up and win a game down a stretch, PSU’s horses just aren’t as good at doing that as others horses.

I hate to harp on the past, for I am usually one who deals in the present and future, but this team misses Cornley and Pringle and in some regards Morrissey. They knew how to finish and win games. This collection of talent that the Nittany’s possess do not have that knowledge yet and I’m not sure if they will obtain it this season.

As for Edwards, who knows…I didn’t think he did anything wrong other than let Bill Cole shoot lights out from 3. Maybe that got him demoted to the bench for the 2nd half in favor of Brooks. Wrong move IMO.[/quote]

This about nails it. Edwards out for D reasons? Hmmm… Jeff did have a couple of blocks and rebounds, but I didn’t notice Edwards getting burned. He doesn’t move that well on D.

I thought two things were important to winning last night, holding down McCamey in scoring(which they did) and attack the basket to get Tisdale in foul trouble(which they didn’t). I don’t think Tisdale was the difference, but still, trying to win Big 10 games by long range shooting will just not work. Michigan struggles with it, and they have Sims as inside option. NW does it, but they complement it with back doors and post ups.

IMO, Ed’s trying to win with what the best PSU players do best, i.e., Battle, Babb and DJ shooting 3’s. But you have to have an offense which includes all players, and gets the less talented players to be a part of the offensive attack, and do what they do best. Is it really smart to have AJ, Ott, Brooks at the arc receiving passes? Are those 3 really so great at setting high ball screens? How many moving screen fouls have been called this year? Is that a good use of fouls? Is that how these 3 can best help the team? I understand in these offenses if you get big men outside, you have different matchups with guards inside. But how often do we benefit by having Battle, Babb, Frazier posting up vs. their men in this scheme?

It’s fundamental in coaching that if something isn’t working, make adjustments. I’ve seen it in personnel changes, but not in style of play.


#7
For the first time since who knows when, Illinois came to play a complete game.

It’s human nature to look within at your own problems, which there are many, yet not take a look at the other side of the court for your answers.

Plain and simple, Illinois came to play.

They moved the ball well, they shot the ball well. Though they let PSU do a few things on their offensive end, they stepped up their defense when it mattered most.

Sure PSU missed a number of free throws which would have and should have made the game a lot more interesting. But fact is, on the possessions that came to decide the game (prior to the free throw fest), the Illini finally played good, hard, sound defense. Something that has been lacking from them this season.

You have to earn each and every victory in the Big Ten this season. There are no gimme’s. PSU can hang with the best the Big Ten has to offer for the first 35-38 minutes of the game, but when the real talent of the Big Ten has to step up and win a game down a stretch, PSU’s horses just aren’t as good at doing that as others horses.

I hate to harp on the past, for I am usually one who deals in the present and future, but this team misses Cornley and Pringle and in some regards Morrissey. They knew how to finish and win games. This collection of talent that the Nittany’s possess do not have that knowledge yet and I’m not sure if they will obtain it this season.

As for Edwards, who knows…I didn’t think he did anything wrong other than let Bill Cole shoot lights out from 3. Maybe that got him demoted to the bench for the 2nd half in favor of Brooks. Wrong move IMO.

As many around us in the BJC pointed out (including myself) they shot well because they had wide open looks. Our defense was once again incognito . I know PSU is offensively challenged but at least they can

try and get into someone on defense,but that hasn’t been the case for 7 years and I don’t think it will change anytime soon. Listening to Dick postgame he made it a point how poorly some of the Illini players have shot from the arc and in general prior to this game and how that seems to be the case with a lot of teams and individual players. They shoot below avg a majority of the season and then seem to light it up against us. I wonder why? NO D

As many wide open looks that they did have, Illinois shot quite a few should we call them prayers that were answered. There were quite a few shots especially McCamey’s 3 at the end of the game which were more than contested. I would be interested if anyone kept track of how many front ends of 1-1’s have we missed up to date.

#8

Sure the Illini were finding open looks, but from the start (and I pointed this out on another thread prior to the game), I thought it would be a mistake to focus on taking McCamey’s shot out of the game (he’s streaky at best), yet let guys like DJ Richardson who is a terrific shooter/creator get his. It burned the Nits from the start and once DJ got rolling, it was hard to stop him due to his array of offensive moves. Add to that the other off guard who played alongside McCamey, Brandon Paul, who found room to roam and put up double-digits.

It’s easy for us to say “Penn State’s defense was horrible” as the reason the Illini shot so well. All five of their guys can pass the ball really well. And if you focus on just trying to take out the guy who burned you in the last game (McCamey), the others, like Richardson and Paul and Cole ( :o) will step up from the perimeter and knock down shots. PSU’s defense wasn’t great, but it wasn’t horrible as they were successful in doing what they set out to do…stop McCamey from scoring at will. The others just stepped up to the plate and delivered.

Sure, they haven’t done that for most of the Big Ten season, but its mostly been because Cole, Paul and Davis haven’t been able to hit the open shots on a consistent basis or any basis for that matter. Last night, they hit them. Kudos.


#9
[quote="tundra, post:1, topic:754"]What happened? I want to watch the game again before I make too many conclusions. Now I just have questions. What happened to rotation from last game? What happened to Edwards? It seems Ed is "seaching, seaching and seaching" every game.[/quote]Edwards started..Played under control and smart...Was then benched for most of the 2nd half in favor of Jeff who did absolutely nothing right. Can't figure out Ed's thinking on this one

A little harsh to say “Jeff did absolutely nothing”. Did he play great? No, but he did bring something last night. We don’t need him to be great every night, but at least bring hustle and desire. He did that last night and contributed some in the box score.


#10
[quote="tundra, post:1, topic:754"]What happened? I want to watch the game again before I make too many conclusions. Now I just have questions. What happened to rotation from last game? What happened to Edwards? It seems Ed is "seaching, seaching and seaching" every game.[/quote]Edwards started..Played under control and smart...Was then benched for most of the 2nd half in favor of Jeff who did absolutely nothing right. Can't figure out Ed's thinking on this one

A little harsh to say “Jeff did absolutely nothing”. Did he play great? No, but he did bring something last night. We don’t need him to be great every night, but at least bring hustle and desire. He did that last night and contributed some in the box score.

1-5 from the floor, 0-2 from 3 (why he plays beyond the arc is for another day), 3 boards …I guess some can say that is bringing something . I just don’t see how you start Bill he does next to nothing wrong plays within himself and then you sit him …just strange

#11

I thought Edwards struggled last night at the defensive end, and gave his man too many open looks. He really needs to work on fighting through screens and going over the top of them, even if it means trailing his man. Last night (and many other times this season), he’s been cutting under the screens and letting his man get a clean look (this is mostly off the ball stuff, however he’s also doing it on the ball). These guys that he’s guarding are too good at this level to give them that much space. Being a freshman, I’m sure that it’s something that he’ll be working on and that will improve a lot over the next 3+ years.


#12

Brooks brought something…He was breathing when he walked onto the court so he did bring something. Basketball wise, not much.


#13

Fighting screens is something that is coached by every college level team. There are several techniques. We are VERY behind the curve in most defensive principles.


#14

One thing I wanted to mention about last night:

The student’s along the court are awesome, and their support is commendable.

The students sitting behind the basket were the weakest bunch of apathetic (and just pathetic) fans I’ve ever seen at a basketball game. There was more excitement from the big donor empty seats than there was in that group of students. Even when the Illini were shooting foul shots right in front of them, they sat on their hands and the only noise came from them chatting with one another and not paying any attention to the game. Pathetic.


#15

I saw the Nits for the second time in person last night. I have been concerned for a long time about why our opponents seem to shoot a much higher percentage than we do, so I focused more on watching the defenses - both PSU’s and ILL’s. Here’s what I saw:

  1. ILL plays a much tougher defense on the ball than we do. They picked up our guards 35 feet from the basket and hung with them. Talor, Chris and Tim has to expend a lot of energy to get into our offense. To be sure, their guards can play tougher ball defense because they’ve got some shot blockers inside which we don’t seem to have.

  2. We continue to give up too many wide open shots - especially to our opponent’s forwards. Babb and Talor seem to do a pretty good job fighting through screens and so their guards didn’t get a lot of wide open shots. Not the case for the forwards - especially in the first five minutes of the game. This may be why Bill Edwards sat for most of the rest of the game.

  3. Especially when Andrew Jones is in the game, our opponents do not cover our center off the ball. When one of the Andrews gets the ball, they rotate to him, but there is little effort expended preventing our centers from getting the ball. I think that’s why early on, Andrew Ott got the ball and made some moves to go to the basket - he got the ball in good position and moved aggressively to the basket. Frankly, until we do more of this with our centers, we’re playing four against five on offense.

  4. Our guards drove to the basket several times, got pounded by their big guys and got no foul calls. Until we start getting some foul calls, their guards can overplay our guards, have our guys drive to the basket, get hammered inside and get no foul calls. Talor got smacked in the face really hard a couple times and so did David Jackson.

  5. I thought Andrew Jones and Andrew Ott did a good job on Tisdale last night. They denied him the ball a lot and held him to 10 points. His jump hook is tough. If the Andrews could learn that shot, they’d be much tougher matchups.

  6. We’ve got a 10 man rotation (including Highberger who I thought played nice D) going right now, so we should be able to play much more aggressive D - we have to in order to hold our opponents shooting percentage down.

And now for the offense:

  1. ILL outshot us 52% (50% on threes) to 40% (35% on threes). I don’t think we’ll improve our shooting much - so its up to us to bring the opponent’s shooting percentage down by playing tough D.

  2. ILL outshot us 72% to 55% from the foul line. If we match them from the foul line, down the stretch its a much closer game which can go either way.

  3. I don’t know if he always shoots this way, but from what I saw last night, Jeff Brook’s shots are way to flat (i.e. line drives). He needs to put a lot more arc on the ball. Even his shots around the basket are flat. Tisdale’s jump hook on the other hand has a lot of arc on it.

General comments: Weber should have gotten at least one T for spending so much time on the floor.

There’s always that one play that turns things around. Against Wiscy, it was a walk call on Andrew Ott when he was going in for a slam late in the game that would have pretty much put it away. Last night, it was the three on one break with us up by three that went off Talor’s hands. I think he took his eye off the ball or something. If he made that, we’re up five and looking good.

We’re competitive in just about every game - not like two years ago when we were getting pounded by 30 after the injury to Geary Claxton. We’re close. We just need a few more things to go right and we’ll get some W’s. Like Dick Jerardi said after the game last night, we just need to learn how to win. I think the talent is there. I agree with Dick when he said early in the season that this is Ed’s best (i.e. most talented) team by far. It’s a matter of realizing our potential.


#16

That’s been an issue since the day he arrived. I think he needs to spend a little time with Jon Crispin after one of these games that he does.


#17

One thing I noticed about our D is that our forwards and really quick to help on ball, thus leaving guys alone on the wing for wide open 3’s. Some of it is too much dribble penetration allowed by the guards, and sometimes they just seem too eager to chase the ball.


#18
[quote="tundra, post:1, topic:754"]What happened? I want to watch the game again before I make too many conclusions. Now I just have questions. What happened to rotation from last game? What happened to Edwards? It seems Ed is "seaching, seaching and seaching" every game.[/quote]Edwards started..Played under control and smart...Was then benched for most of the 2nd half in favor of Jeff who did absolutely nothing right. Can't figure out Ed's thinking on this one

A little harsh to say “Jeff did absolutely nothing”. Did he play great? No, but he did bring something last night. We don’t need him to be great every night, but at least bring hustle and desire. He did that last night and contributed some in the box score.

Agreed on Brooks. He played hard last night, which was great to see. And our defense was terrible again last night. Illini didn’t get open shots because they passed the ball very well last night. They got open shots last ngiht for the same reason every decent team gets good shots against PSU - we play terrible defense. We don’t recognize shooters or time/score scenarios, and our defensive rotations are terrible. There is a reason every team seems to get hot against us - its terrible defense.


#19

We’re competitive in just about every game - not like two years ago when we were getting pounded by 30 after the injury to Geary Claxton. We’re close. We just need a few more things to go right and we’ll get some W’s. Like Dick Jerardi said after the game last night, we just need to learn how to win. I think the talent is there. I agree with Dick when he said early in the season that this is Ed’s best (i.e. most talented) team by far. It’s a matter of realizing our potential.
[/quote]

First, I don’t understand why everyone treats Dick Jerardi like he’s Bobby Knight or John Wooden. Yes, he’s a knowledgable announcer, but he’s a basketball savant. Second, saying this team was more talented than last year’s team is ridiculous. Last year’s team was far more talented. Cornley is playing in the NBDL and Pringle is excelling in Europe. Those are two very, very talented players. Saying this team has more “talent” because it has more athletes is worthless.

Cornley and Pringle were probably two of the most talented basketball players to ever play at PSU. And I mean talent in terms of knowing how to play the game and skill level.