Big Ten Grades So Far


#1

It’s still so early, but I thought I’d throw this one out there after watching three nights and eleven games of action. This is only one fan’s view of how the Big Ten is starting to stack up…

Purdue A They’ve certainly looked every bit the part of a national contender.

Michigan State B+ Ran into a hot UNC team on their home floor. Don’t seem to have quite the chemistry necessary yet. But the combo of Izzo and their talent/experience will have them playing for the title in March. The loss to Florida drops them a notch.

Ohio State A Really athletic team. Impressive inside/outside scoring ability. Turner puts them over the top. Easily disposed of a good FSU team.

Illinois A- Was ready to give them a C (for Crappy) after the first half last night, but once again Weber showed me why he is a terrific coach. The most impressive win in the Challenge, though Wisconsin’s performance was a thing of beauty. Paul and Richardson will be special players in the Big Ten this season. A-minus due to slip up in Vegas last week.

Wisconsin A+ Bo Ryan is doing it again. Tremendous win last night following a really good showing in Maui. If Bohannon ever dials it in from long distance, watch out.

Northwestern A++ NC State is not that good, but take nothing away from the 'Cats performance on Tuesday night or their win against Notre Dame. All without Coble :o. Call me impressed.

Minnesota B Not sure what to make of them yet. Played a nice game against a solid Miami team last night, just couldn’t finish the drill. I think they’ll be inconsistent for the most part, as they beat Butler but lost to both Portland and Texas A&M

Penn State B+ I’m willing to give this team a chance to put the Charleston Classic behind them. Like Illinois, I was ready to give them a C after the first half of Monday’s game, but Battle and Company showed me something. I like the fact that they will get another good test right away, this weekend in Philly.

Michigan C Hail to the Victors ::slight_smile: Probably the biggest disappointment of the Challenge for the Big Ten. Despite a late charge, Michigan was never really in the game last night. After losing to Marquette and Alabama really needed to show up strong last night, and they did not.

Indiana B I love teams that give great effort despite their shortcomings. This team does not lack for that effort and for that I commend them. They will pull off a couple :o :o this season.

Iowa C Not a good team, but like Indy, they will at least give an effort.


#2

Northwestern: A+. I’m amazed with how well they’ve handled the Coble injury…maybe that first NCAA tournament bid is still well within their reach, something I didn’t think I’d be saying three weeks ago.

Purdue: A. They’ve lived up to expectations. I still think missing Jackson (possibly for the year?) could hinder them. But they do have good depth and a healthy Hummel makes all the difference…didn’t we see that last year in the postseason. I think they’re a near lock for a No. 1 or No. 2 seed in the dance and they could be in line for their first Final Four in almost 30 years.

Michigan State: B+. Seems like another typical Izzo team. They’re super talented, yet not even close to playing at their potential at this point in the season. So, they’ll take a couple losses against good teams in the typical murderer’s row of conference play. I think the Big Ten comes down to them and Purdue, not that that is any kind of breaking news.

Ohio State: B+. Aside from the national runner-up team (Oden was just that good), I’ve felt Ohio State didn’t equal the sum of its part the past few years…and I’m probably not the only one to feel that way. I think this team, however, could be…and they might be the challenger to MSU/Purdue at the top of the league. I think having Lighty back really helps them defensively.

Wisconsin: B+. Maybe they could be in the A range, but I guess I’m a tough grader. Coming in, I thought this might finally be the year that they slid back a little bit to 7th or maybe even 8th in the conference. As usual, I’m wrong. They look really solid to me…but I guess we’d expect nothing less from Bo Ryan.

Illinois: B. Last night definitely helped the GPA for these guys. I’m not as sold on the young guys as NittanyIllini is, but I think they’ll definitely get better and be really tough in February…while still having an occasional game where they just look like freshmen. Weber has done a nice job rebounding there, because I thought after the misses on top recruits, Scheyer and Gordon, along with that putrid '07-'08 season, things were getting a little dicey for him. Still in my bottom rung of Big Ten teams that I personally like, but have to give them tons of credit…especially for showing some toughness last night.

Penn State: B-. Charleston is the only thing keeping this down for me. If it had just been one disappointing loss, I think it would be a B or a B+. But we, am I allowed to say we?, looked so uninspired those last two games. Not really anymore analysis than that, since things have been covered in other threads, but I’m still really, really looking forward to watching this team play (even though I know there are going to be frustrating nights).

Indiana: C+. Up front, I don’t like IU and wish a thousand plagues on the hallowed halls of Assembly Hall. But this team does give maximum effort and Crean has them on the bench if they don’t. So, they’re sort of, somewhat fun to watch. I really like Watford and Creek…good young players. I think they’ll beat some conference teams at home, too.

Minnesota: C. Three-game skid, but I still think these guys are pretty good. Maybe the grade is a little low, especially since every loss has been by two possessions or less. At the same time, however, they sort of remind me of Ohio State (a less star-rated crew) of the past couple years. There are a lot of nice parts, but they don’t seem to be playing well together. Hopefully they don’t start doing that until after their Big Ten opener on Dec. 29 against you know who.

Michigan: D. Most disappointing team, by far, to me. I may have overrated them for sure, but I thought they’d be in the mix as the league’s third best team. I’ll also acknowledge they’re probably the team I’ve seen the least of, having only watched their Old Spice opener against Creighton and bits and pieces of a couple other games. But they’ve looked like they looked in Happy Valley last year…just wildly jacking shots off one or two passes. I still think they have enough to be a second weekend NCAA tournament team, but they have really underacheived in my mind.

Iowa: F. The effort was there against Texas and Hokie Tech…but other than that, these guys look awful. This isn’t a Sampson job at IU, this is the team that Lickliter has somehow brought upon himself (with the exception of the Jake Kelley situation). He ran off Alford’s guys. He ran off JUCO guys that he brought in. He ran off some of his own recruits. I’m sure they’ll still pull a shocker or two in conference play (just please say it’s not us again), but 3-15 in league play is something for which they should strive.


#3

including PSU at B-. I’d give them a C-- after losing to two minor league teams.

PSU had a nice win vs. Virginia. Problem is that UVA is not a real good team, and Battle had to do it all for PSU. If he doesn’t get hot PSU is in serious trouble.

The keys to this season IMO:

  1. Edwards. He’s the only PSU big man with an ability to take the ball strong to the basket.

  2. Frazier. His confidence, decision making, and outside shooting have to improve.

  3. Babb. We need a perimeter threat to replace Pringle. I’m concerned that Babb’s stroke involves a lot of arm movement and that makes it difficult for him to be consistent.


#4

Here is an interesting concept. OF course, Im not sure that its 100% statistically sound so if anybody want to adjust it feel free. I took each BT team’s Win/Loss%, Offensive efficiency rating, defensive efficiency rating, and strength of schedule rating. I then took there current positions against the 347 teams to determine their percentage rank in each category. In taking the average of all four categories, I compared it against an academic plus/minus grading scale. The following is what happens:

B+ Wisconsin
B- Purdue
C- Minnesota
C- Northwestern
D+ Ohio State
D- Illinois
D- Michigan State
F Penn State
F Michigan
F Indiana
F Iowa


#5

[quote=“mhenry41, post:4, topic:405”] Here is an interesting concept. OF course, Im not sure that its 100% statistically sound so if anybody want to adjust it feel free. I took each BT team’s Win/Loss%, Offensive efficiency rating, defensive efficiency rating, and strength of schedule rating. I then took there current positions against the 347 teams to determine their percentage rank in each category. In taking the average of all four categories, I compared it against an academic plus/minus grading scale. The following is what happens:

B+ Wisconsin
B- Purdue
C- Minnesota
C- Northwestern
D+ Ohio State
D- Illinois
D- Michigan State
F Penn State
F Michigan
F Indiana
F Iowa[/quote]

To properly curve this, you’d want to set the 50% point as a C. At least traditionally, that would be best. Then, if you calculated the variance of the distribution, you could set the B as 1 standard deviation above the C. Not sure how you did this, but I’m assuming you assumed that a 75% would be a C.


#6

[quote=“PSUQuaker, post:2, topic:405”]Northwestern: A+. I’m amazed with how well they’ve handled the Coble injury…maybe that first NCAA tournament bid is still well within their reach, something I didn’t think I’d be saying three weeks ago.

Purdue: A. They’ve lived up to expectations. I still think missing Jackson (possibly for the year?) could hinder them. But they do have good depth and a healthy Hummel makes all the difference…didn’t we see that last year in the postseason. I think they’re a near lock for a No. 1 or No. 2 seed in the dance and they could be in line for their first Final Four in almost 30 years.

Michigan State: B+. Seems like another typical Izzo team. They’re super talented, yet not even close to playing at their potential at this point in the season. So, they’ll take a couple losses against good teams in the typical murderer’s row of conference play. I think the Big Ten comes down to them and Purdue, not that that is any kind of breaking news.

Ohio State: B+. Aside from the national runner-up team (Oden was just that good), I’ve felt Ohio State didn’t equal the sum of its part the past few years…and I’m probably not the only one to feel that way. I think this team, however, could be…and they might be the challenger to MSU/Purdue at the top of the league. I think having Lighty back really helps them defensively.

Wisconsin: B+. Maybe they could be in the A range, but I guess I’m a tough grader. Coming in, I thought this might finally be the year that they slid back a little bit to 7th or maybe even 8th in the conference. As usual, I’m wrong. They look really solid to me…but I guess we’d expect nothing less from Bo Ryan.

Illinois: B. Last night definitely helped the GPA for these guys. I’m not as sold on the young guys as NittanyIllini is, but I think they’ll definitely get better and be really tough in February…while still having an occasional game where they just look like freshmen. Weber has done a nice job rebounding there, because I thought after the misses on top recruits, Scheyer and Gordon, along with that putrid '07-'08 season, things were getting a little dicey for him. Still in my bottom rung of Big Ten teams that I personally like, but have to give them tons of credit…especially for showing some toughness last night.

Penn State: B-. Charleston is the only thing keeping this down for me. If it had just been one disappointing loss, I think it would be a B or a B+. But we, am I allowed to say we?, looked so uninspired those last two games. Not really anymore analysis than that, since things have been covered in other threads, but I’m still really, really looking forward to watching this team play (even though I know there are going to be frustrating nights).

Indiana: C+. Up front, I don’t like IU and wish a thousand plagues on the hallowed halls of Assembly Hall. But this team does give maximum effort and Crean has them on the bench if they don’t. So, they’re sort of, somewhat fun to watch. I really like Watford and Creek…good young players. I think they’ll beat some conference teams at home, too.

Minnesota: C. Three-game skid, but I still think these guys are pretty good. Maybe the grade is a little low, especially since every loss has been by two possessions or less. At the same time, however, they sort of remind me of Ohio State (a less star-rated crew) of the past couple years. There are a lot of nice parts, but they don’t seem to be playing well together. Hopefully they don’t start doing that until after their Big Ten opener on Dec. 29 against you know who.

Michigan: D. Most disappointing team, by far, to me. I may have overrated them for sure, but I thought they’d be in the mix as the league’s third best team. I’ll also acknowledge they’re probably the team I’ve seen the least of, having only watched their Old Spice opener against Creighton and bits and pieces of a couple other games. But they’ve looked like they looked in Happy Valley last year…just wildly jacking shots off one or two passes. I still think they have enough to be a second weekend NCAA tournament team, but they have really underacheived in my mind.

Iowa: F. The effort was there against Texas and Hokie Tech…but other than that, these guys look awful. This isn’t a Sampson job at IU, this is the team that Lickliter has somehow brought upon himself (with the exception of the Jake Kelley situation). He ran off Alford’s guys. He ran off JUCO guys that he brought in. He ran off some of his own recruits. I’m sure they’ll still pull a shocker or two in conference play (just please say it’s not us again), but 3-15 in league play is something for which they should strive.[/quote]

Good stuff Quaker. You’re a little tougher on the grades, but I also take into account what these teams were expected to do this season and factor that in. So as poor a team as they are, I find it hard to give Iowa an “F”. Maybe Michigan deserves that letter…but for other reasons ;D

As for the Illini, I think I got a little caught up in the afterglow of the great comeback. They will probably be like Minnesota this season and be up and down, as exhibited by their Jekyll and Hyde act in the first and second halves of Wednesday’s game. B+ is more like it for now. But I have been very impressed by both Paul and Richardson. Those two led the team to the comeback with tremendous play on both ends of the court.


#7
[quote="mhenry41, post:4, topic:405"]Here is an interesting concept. OF course, Im not sure that its 100% statistically sound so if anybody want to adjust it feel free. I took each BT team's Win/Loss%, Offensive efficiency rating, defensive efficiency rating, and strength of schedule rating. I then took there current positions against the 347 teams to determine their percentage rank in each category. In taking the average of all four categories, I compared it against an academic plus/minus grading scale. The following is what happens:

B+ Wisconsin
B- Purdue
C- Minnesota
C- Northwestern
D+ Ohio State
D- Illinois
D- Michigan State
F Penn State
F Michigan
F Indiana
F Iowa[/quote]

To properly curve this, you’d want to set the 50% point as a C. At least traditionally, that would be best. Then, if you calculated the variance of the distribution, you could set the B as 1 standard deviation above the C. Not sure how you did this, but I’m assuming you assumed that a 75% would be a C.

Ronb, this is a good point. If Im going to use the entire country (as i did) then I would need to use 50% as a C and so on. I’ll readjust. If I assign: A=93%+, A-=86%+, B+=79%+, B=71%+, B-=64%+, C+=57%+, C=50%+, C-=42%+, D+=36%+, D=29%+, D-=21%+, F is = or < 21%.

A Wisconsin 87%
B+ Purdue 82%
B Minnesota 72%
B- Northwestern 70%
B- Ohio State 68%
C+ Illinois 61%
C+ Michigan State 60%
C+ Michigan 57%
C- Penn State 47%
C- Indiana 43%
D+ Iowa 36%


#8

For what its worth, Temple currently is a 68% for a B- which puts them in about the same place as Ohio State thus far…


#9

Purdue A+
Northwestern A-
Wisconsin A-
Ohio State A-
Michigan State B
Minnesota C-
Michigan C-
Penn State D
Illinois D
Indiana D-
Iowa F

I have no mandatory bell curve. Penn State came into last week flunking, but showed up for the sacred heart quiz and did ok on the ACC test


#10

I agree on us at C-. Lots of opportunity to recover though.


#11
[quote="mhenry41, post:4, topic:405"]Here is an interesting concept. OF course, Im not sure that its 100% statistically sound so if anybody want to adjust it feel free. I took each BT team's Win/Loss%, Offensive efficiency rating, defensive efficiency rating, and strength of schedule rating. I then took there current positions against the 347 teams to determine their percentage rank in each category. In taking the average of all four categories, I compared it against an academic plus/minus grading scale. The following is what happens:

B+ Wisconsin
B- Purdue
C- Minnesota
C- Northwestern
D+ Ohio State
D- Illinois
D- Michigan State
F Penn State
F Michigan
F Indiana
F Iowa[/quote]

To properly curve this, you’d want to set the 50% point as a C. At least traditionally, that would be best. Then, if you calculated the variance of the distribution, you could set the B as 1 standard deviation above the C. Not sure how you did this, but I’m assuming you assumed that a 75% would be a C.

Ronb, this is a good point. If Im going to use the entire country (as i did) then I would need to use 50% as a C and so on. I’ll readjust. If I assign: A=93%+, A-=86%+, B+=79%+, B=71%+, B-=64%+, C+=57%+, C=50%+, C-=42%+, D+=36%+, D=29%+, D-=21%+, F is = or < 21%.

A Wisconsin 87%
B+ Purdue 82%
B Minnesota 72%
B- Northwestern 70%
B- Ohio State 68%
C+ Illinois 61%
C+ Michigan State 60%
C+ Michigan 57%
C- Penn State 47%
C- Indiana 43%
D+ Iowa 36%

This looks like a reasonable assessment so far. Interesting to see how high Minny and NW come out with these numbers, and how low MSU and Michgan are.


#12
[quote="mhenry41, post:4, topic:405"]Here is an interesting concept. OF course, Im not sure that its 100% statistically sound so if anybody want to adjust it feel free. I took each BT team's Win/Loss%, Offensive efficiency rating, defensive efficiency rating, and strength of schedule rating. I then took there current positions against the 347 teams to determine their percentage rank in each category. In taking the average of all four categories, I compared it against an academic plus/minus grading scale. The following is what happens:

B+ Wisconsin
B- Purdue
C- Minnesota
C- Northwestern
D+ Ohio State
D- Illinois
D- Michigan State
F Penn State
F Michigan
F Indiana
F Iowa[/quote]

To properly curve this, you’d want to set the 50% point as a C. At least traditionally, that would be best. Then, if you calculated the variance of the distribution, you could set the B as 1 standard deviation above the C. Not sure how you did this, but I’m assuming you assumed that a 75% would be a C.

Ronb, this is a good point. If Im going to use the entire country (as i did) then I would need to use 50% as a C and so on. I’ll readjust. If I assign: A=93%+, A-=86%+, B+=79%+, B=71%+, B-=64%+, C+=57%+, C=50%+, C-=42%+, D+=36%+, D=29%+, D-=21%+, F is = or < 21%.

A Wisconsin 87%
B+ Purdue 82%
B Minnesota 72%
B- Northwestern 70%
B- Ohio State 68%
C+ Illinois 61%
C+ Michigan State 60%
C+ Michigan 57%
C- Penn State 47%
C- Indiana 43%
D+ Iowa 36%

Nicely done, mhenry. A classic numbers approach to my eyeballin’ it.


#13

Thanks Nittanyillini. I saved this spreadsheet, so I think I will keep track of it once a week. Not sure if anybody cares to see it or not. But I find it interesting. I think its also cool to show PSU’s current opponents.


#14

I think I’d put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they’d better get there sooner than the end of the year


#15

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:


#16
[quote="psu2006, post:14, topic:405"]I think I'd put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they'd better get there sooner than the end of the year[/quote]

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:

I thought you were Captain Cranky. You sure your name isn’t Captain Cool-aid? I’m with you. I’m enjoying watching guys like Frazier and Edwards play. And guys like Babb and Woodyard finding their spot on the team. The only problem we’ve had so far is we haven’t figured out how to score consistently when Battle is getting mugged. We’ll get it figured out.


#17
[quote="psu2006, post:14, topic:405"]I think I'd put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they'd better get there sooner than the end of the year[/quote]

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:

I thought you were Captain Cranky. You sure your name isn’t Captain Cool-aid? I’m with you. I’m enjoying watching guys like Frazier and Edwards play. And guys like Babb and Woodyard finding their spot on the team. The only problem we’ve had so far is we haven’t figured out how to score consistently when Battle is getting mugged. We’ll get it figured out.

I never said what makes me Cranky. :slight_smile:

Lately it has been post after post from the Chicken Little crowd wailing “Woe is Us” about Penn State Basketball after nearly every game. ::slight_smile:


#18
[quote="psu2006, post:14, topic:405"]I think I'd put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they'd better get there sooner than the end of the year[/quote]

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:

I thought you were Captain Cranky. You sure your name isn’t Captain Cool-aid? I’m with you. I’m enjoying watching guys like Frazier and Edwards play. And guys like Babb and Woodyard finding their spot on the team. The only problem we’ve had so far is we haven’t figured out how to score consistently when Battle is getting mugged. We’ll get it figured out.

I never said what makes me Cranky. :slight_smile:

Lately it has been post after post from the Chicken Little crowd wailing “Woe is Us” about Penn State Basketball after nearly every game. ::slight_smile:

And it hasn’t even gotten ugly yet. Where were you two/three seasons ago? That was bad.


#19
[quote="psu2006, post:14, topic:405"]I think I'd put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they'd better get there sooner than the end of the year[/quote]

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:

I don’t think I have overzealous expectations, I am giving them a C or less for the OOC because of the losses in Charleston. We have to admit, those were pretty bad. Are we supposed to give them an A for effort against Temple? I think that the standards are a little higher than that. The defense has looked better, but they’ve also scored less than 30 points in 4 of the last 6 halves of play. D+ might be generous. Plenty of season ahead though. If they can win 7 or 8 big ten games, I’d give them a B+, more than that and they definitely get an A


#20
[quote="psu2006, post:14, topic:405"]I think I'd put Penn State at a D+ now. They could get up to about a C if they win the rest of their OOC games. I think the team will be much better as the year goes on, but they'd better get there sooner than the end of the year[/quote]

??? What is with you guys? The team is 6-3, with a nice win over Virginia and an improvement on the defensive end the past two games. They have received some good national recognition thus far and have just 3 more games to play, against some suspect competition. If this season is a D+ or C-, then what would a season start like 2007, or a season start like 2006 rank?

Get a grip. This is a fun, exciting young team that has been able to find their groove lately. Ramp down the overzealous expectations and some of you might actually enjoy this season. ::slight_smile:

I thought you were Captain Cranky. You sure your name isn’t Captain Cool-aid? I’m with you. I’m enjoying watching guys like Frazier and Edwards play. And guys like Babb and Woodyard finding their spot on the team. The only problem we’ve had so far is we haven’t figured out how to score consistently when Battle is getting mugged. We’ll get it figured out.

I never said what makes me Cranky. :slight_smile:

Lately it has been post after post from the Chicken Little crowd wailing “Woe is Us” about Penn State Basketball after nearly every game. ::slight_smile:

And it hasn’t even gotten ugly yet. Where were you two/three seasons ago? That was bad.

That is a shame, but not surprising. There are some inconsiderate and rude people on here, not to name any names. They know who they are. >:(

I just found about this site a short while back. If it were bad here, I would just quit. No sense in allowing yourself to put up with that kinda crap.