PennStateHoops.com Discussion Forum

Big 10/ACC challenge


#1

LOVE Bo Ryan.


#2

I’ve gotta admit, not following things quite as much yet. Has this been a match-up thing, or is the Big 10 way up on the ACC this year.


#3

Think the matchups really favored the Big 10/12.


#4

The B10 has been the highest ranked conference in most of the rating systems for most of the year.

Pomeroy: B10=1, ACC=5
RPI: B10=1, ACC=3
Sagarin: B10-1, ACC=3, 4, or 5 (depending on which of Sagarin’s 3 methodologies you want to use)


#5

My sense is that we suffered from matching our best two up against UNC and Duke, and then it was a bunch of coin flips after that.


#6

Did all teams participate this year now that we’re 12 strong? Does that mean we could have potentially tied in this thing this year?


#7

Yes. Yes.


#8
[quote="Craftsy21, post:6, topic:2887"]Did all teams participate this year now that we're 12 strong? Does that mean we could have potentially tied in this thing this year?[/quote]

Yes. Yes.


I used to say that back when the ACC won every year, they always sat one of our mid-level teams and that made some of the matchups at the bottom of the brackets tough for us… Duke/UNC is a tough cover (a split is as good as you’re ever going to get) and then we ended up with some clunker match-ups in the middle.

I do think their recent expansions have not helped… BC, Miami, VaTech are not top 1/2 adds to the conference, of course that’s now balanced a bit by Neb.

It’s also a down year for ACC… GaTech, Wake and Maryland are not anywhere NEAR where they usually are. Those were 3 games that were always tough covers in the past.


#9
[quote="Craftsy21, post:6, topic:2887"]Did all teams participate this year now that we're 12 strong? Does that mean we could have potentially tied in this thing this year?[/quote]

Yes. Yes.


I used to say that back when the ACC won every year, they always sat one of our mid-level teams and that made some of the matchups at the bottom of the brackets tough for us… Duke/UNC is a tough cover (a split is as good as you’re ever going to get) and then we ended up with some clunker match-ups in the middle.

I do think their recent expansions have not helped… BC, Miami, VaTech are not top 1/2 adds to the conference, of course that’s now balanced a bit by Neb.

It’s also a down year for ACC… GaTech, Wake and Maryland are not anywhere NEAR where they usually are. Those were 3 games that were always tough covers in the past.

Wonder what ACC teams will get left out when Pitt and 'Cuse are in the mix.


#10
[quote="Craftsy21, post:6, topic:2887"]Did all teams participate this year now that we're 12 strong? Does that mean we could have potentially tied in this thing this year?[/quote]

Yes. Yes.


I used to say that back when the ACC won every year, they always sat one of our mid-level teams and that made some of the matchups at the bottom of the brackets tough for us… Duke/UNC is a tough cover (a split is as good as you’re ever going to get) and then we ended up with some clunker match-ups in the middle.

I do think their recent expansions have not helped… BC, Miami, VaTech are not top 1/2 adds to the conference, of course that’s now balanced a bit by Neb.

It’s also a down year for ACC… GaTech, Wake and Maryland are not anywhere NEAR where they usually are. Those were 3 games that were always tough covers in the past.

When I used to keep better track of these things, it was surprising how inconsistent the rest of the ACC was. It’s basically UNC and Duke and a halo effect. Big Ten teams were much more likely to climb out of the middle tier and get to the Final Four.

Now granted, UNC and Duke are some kind of halo.


#11

Then again, people were talking about a down year for the Big Ten with a lot of seniors leaving from MSU, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Penn State…

All of a sudden, the Big Ten looks formidable again. Great coaching and the fact that smart kids are recruited for a system at their respective schools and seem to pick up on that system.

Also, I think a lot of ACC teams crumble when they face tougher, more defensive-minded teams.


#12

[quote=“NittanyIllini, post:11, topic:2887”]Then again, people were talking about a down year for the Big Ten with a lot of seniors leaving from MSU, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Penn State…

All of a sudden, the Big Ten looks formidable again. Great coaching and the fact that smart kids are recruited for a system at their respective schools and seem to pick up on that system.

Also, I think a lot of ACC teams crumble when they face tougher, more defensive-minded teams.[/quote]

A lot depends on the refs in the NCAA tournament. Often what is a foul in the ACC or the PAC-12 is just incidental contact and no foul in the Big Ten. Also, the BIG seems to allow a lot more “palming” and/or “high dribbles” than the other conferences do.

I’ve said this before, but the NCAA needs to go to nationwide refs for all sports including football and basketball and not just conference refs.


#13

I’m pretty sure hoops refs are universal.


#14

Yeah, but since the days of Dick Harter I have noticed that they “adjust” to what’s happening on the floor.

Watching about the 486th moving pick from Wisconsin that did not get called last night, I was reminded of that.


#15

Basketball refs aren’t assigned to a conference like in football; however, they do tend to work particular conferences more frequently than others. I believe they’re in essence independent contractors.


#16

They aren’t assigned to just one conference. But most assignments will come from the conference’s Officiating Assignor. So each conference has a “pool” of officials that they draw from, but you’ll see most guys work in multiple conferences. Once you get to the postseason, the assignments come from the NCAA’s assignor.


#17
[quote="LPcreation, post:13, topic:2887"]I'm pretty sure hoops refs are universal.[/quote]

Yeah, but since the days of Dick Harter I have noticed that they “adjust” to what’s happening on the floor.

Watching about the 486th moving pick from Wisconsin that did not get called last night, I was reminded of that.

Refs are people too. I would guess they get tied up in hype etc etc etc…
You know…“Joe Blow’s teams are SO perfectly coached!!!”


#18

I believe the football refs are still just part-timers. I think they work a conference and maybe some bowls, which may be about 15 gigs a year. They have full time career, unlike college refs, who may work up to 7 days a week from Nov to April. A lot of careers don’t allow for that kind of absentee-ism.


#19
[b]Basketball refs aren't assigned to a conference like in football[/b]; however, they do tend to work particular conferences more frequently than others. I believe they're in essence independent contractors.

I believe the football refs are still just part-timers. I think they work a conference and maybe some bowls, which may be about 15 gigs a year. They have full time career, unlike college refs, who may work up to 7 days a week from Nov to April. A lot of careers don’t allow for that kind of absentee-ism.

Apparently being a school district superintendent is one of those careers that doesn’t care if a guy shows up to work for half the year. Just ask Ed Hightower, Superintendent of Edwardsville, IL Public Schools.


#20
[b]Basketball refs aren't assigned to a conference like in football[/b]; however, they do tend to work particular conferences more frequently than others. I believe they're in essence independent contractors.

I believe the football refs are still just part-timers. I think they work a conference and maybe some bowls, which may be about 15 gigs a year. They have full time career, unlike college refs, who may work up to 7 days a week from Nov to April. A lot of careers don’t allow for that kind of absentee-ism.

The majority of college hoops refs do have full time careers. They are just careers that are flexible enough that the officiating can squeeze in there. Doing 7 games a week from November to April is the extreme. The NCAA ref that I know does about 2-3 games a week, and many are within driving distance so he can skip out of work a few hours early and be back home to sleep in his bed that night.